David Smith , Jan 17, 2012; 05:25 p.m.
I was wondering if any of the CMC crew might have some information on the Japanese lens maker Tomioka. Specifically in regards to their production of Yashica glass. I have perused the Googlenet and come up with a basic history of the company but found conflicting dates as to when they were taken over by Yashica. One source sites 1949 and the other says it occurred in 1968. What I am trying to put together is exactly how much of the Yashica ML series were actually made by Tomioka, or what they became after the take over which is basically Yashicas in-house glass maker.
I would assume that many, or most, of the DX, DS, DS-B and DS-M Yashinons were made by Tomioka. Is this true? And did they manufacture every focal lenght and version of the ML series? What about the aborted YUS line of lenses?
The reason I am curious is that as my small Yashica glass collection grows I find myself very endeared to the photos they produce. There is something about Yashica bokeh that I absolutely love. And I am wondering if it stems from the designs and production of Tomioka. I have many different lenses in many different mounts that I use on both film and digital bodies thru the use of adapters but I can honestly see myself getting rid of every thing but the Yashicas in either C/Y mount or M42. (And a couple of other M42's I just couldnt part with, like my Mamiya Sekor 55/1.8).
So help me out CMC. At the time of C/Y mount ML production was Tomioka in house and making the entire range? I have noticed that the first series of ML lenses are almost exact copies of their DS-M counterparts. This is probably the case and only the rear of the lens was changed to facilitate the new mount. So if Tomioka made the old DS-M Yashinons then they probably made the first series of ML's. And the second plastic versions as well. And their C/Y mount Zeiss counterparts?
Any help/info to fill in the gaps will be greatly appreciated.
Dan Fromm , Jan 17, 2012; 06:30 p.m.
<shaking head> Look here: https://www.google.com/search?q=tomioka+yashica&hl=en&num=100&lr=&ft=i&cr=&safe=images </shaking head>
Lauren MacIntosh 
, Jan 17, 2012; 10:03 p.m.
Dan fromm be careful shaking that head you might lose it :
Jody S 
, Jan 18, 2012; 03:52 a.m.
Dan Fromm might have the most practical response here... (I say that under duress, as his manners usually preclude any agreement from my part).
Your Yashica grlass produces wonderful images, that you love? You've never seen a 'bad' Yashinon lens (neither have I)? So.... what's the problem? You can't prove that 'x' lens was made by a factory bearing the Yashica or Tomioka brand? I don't think that really matters. Find me an example of a bad lens made under either label, I might start to care. Yes, Yashica took over the Tomioka factory, that's like saying Rolls Royce took over a Bentley assembly plant. If you can find records to show the exact year and serial number, great. Otherwise, it's still the same factories producing the same high-quality lenses.
Rick Drawbridge 
, Jan 18, 2012; 04:37 a.m.
David, like you I have a liking for Yashinon lenses, but trying to find answers to all the questions you raise is frustrating and time -consuming. Here's the best potted history/timeline I've come across, with few contentious issues.
http://www.tlr-cameras.com/Japanese/Tomioka%20Lenses.html
Tomioka produced so many lenses that were re-badged for their customers; the fabled 55mm Tomioka f/1.2, for example, was also produced as: Auto Chinon, Auto Cosinon, Auto Yashinon, Auto Revuenon, Auto Yashinon DS-M, & Auto Tominon.
If you have the dates of manufacture of the Yashinon lenses you're interested in, the quote from the site above may be of help:
"From late 1949, it (Tomioka) became the exclusive lens supplier for Yashica, becoming a Yashica affiliate/subsidiary in 1968, and named the Tomioka Optical Corporation from 1969"
There's no implication that, after 1949, Tomioka ceased making lenses for customers other than Yashica, but one could infer that, from 1949 on, Tomioka made all Yashica's lenses. Best I can do, I'm afraid. There are plenty of leads out on the Net but basically they all lead to the same ends, with no definitive statement as to which Yashinon/Yashicor lenses Tomioka made.
Dan Fromm , Jan 18, 2012; 08:51 a.m.
Hmm. I'm not so strongly in favor of lenses made by Tomioka as Jody or Rick.
Item: back when I was much younger and before Yashica failed and was taken over by Kyocera, reviews of Yashica SLRs and Yashica's lenses to fit them in Modern Photography and Popular Photography weren't glowing. The lenses weren't then seen as top drawer. This was also the mags view of Yashica TLRs and their lenses. OK, but not the best tessar clones.
Item: I've had multiple examples of all of the Tomioka lenses made for the Polaroid MP-4 but the 105/4.5, never had a 105/4.5. The 17/4 and 35/4.5 are usable and usually very cost effective; not Luminars, not priced like them either. The 50/4.5 and 75/4.5 are usable, even more cost effective. My three 135/4.5s were all dogs, as in, not very usable; I wouldn't recommend that lens to anyone for any application.
Kyocera-era lenses in C/Y mount may well be much better. I once bought -- long story -- an FX3/2000 with 50ish and 100ish Yashinon macro lenses for a biologist in Peru, recall that at the time that combination was seen as a sleeper relative to, e.g., my FM2n, 55/2.8 and 105/2.8 AIS MicroNikkors. Much less expensive, functionally nearly, possibly fully, equivalent.
Jeff Adler , Jan 18, 2012; 09:01 a.m.
It's hard to know why a person would be curious about something. I recently posted a question about a 100/2.5 MC Tele Rokkor-PF. The lens has the same type of coating as the MC Rokkor-X but also has the tab at the rear for depth of field preview. I thought these two lenses were supposed to be identical except for the front marking and that the non-Rokkor-X models were for markets outside of the U.S. The responses to my question contained references to various websites. Not one of these websites answered my question. Anyone can use a search engine to look for information. The purpose of a posting here is to find out whether any other people have some knowledge of the equipment in question.
Dan Fromm , Jan 18, 2012; 11:35 a.m.
Jeff, that's very interesting. I'm a Nikonist, don't normally pay much attention to Minolta cameras or lenses. But you piqued my curiosity so I asked Google to look for Rokkor.
Here's a link to the first hit, which explains the tab you wanted to know about: http://www.rokkorfiles.com/Lens%20History.html
Tom Cheshire , Jan 18, 2012; 01:20 p.m.
Well, that is very interesting. 1949, huh? Ok, it was Yashica's sole glass supplier but, as Rick said, that doesn't mean they did not still sell to other companies (looking at my Royal M35 produced circa 1957 with Tomionar lens).
David Smith , Jan 18, 2012; 07:30 p.m.
Let me start this reply with something my mother once told me. If you have nothing nice to say to a person, dont say anything at all.
Lauren- I like your style. :)
Jody- Theres no 'problem', and Im not quite sure of the direction of your response. My inquiry was simply to see if anyone here had some interesting tidbits of knowledge concerning how Yashica went about the Tomioka aquisition. While I am a photographer and use these lenses to make photos I am also a collector and I like to dig up the histories of old equipment that I use from this dead and gone manual focus era. Its fun to discuss this stuff with other people of like interests. I dont think I have a single friend or family member who would have any inclination to have a conversation with me if it started like "So, Tomioka was purchased by Yashica in 1968, but had been using them exclusively since '49 for their lens production. I wonder how many of the old Yahinons were made by them. What do you think?" Nope, that wouldnt go well at all.
Rick- As usual sir your response is well written, informative, courteous and provides me with at least some of the information I was looking for. I must say I was looking forward to your reply as I did seem to remember you are a Yashinon fan as well. Thanks for the link, that was one that I had already found in my somewhat intensive googlenet search I had conducted previous to this post. And thanks as well for the clarification of the 49/68 issue. You and Tom are absolutely correct about Tomioka continuing to manufacture lenses for other brands after 49 when they became the exclusive supplier to Yashica. And that answers my question about which lenses Tomioka made for Yashica. Basically everything after that date which is most of the lenses Im interested in, including my YUS 28/2.8 which sometimes suprises me with lovely bokeh. It would be interesting to find out if Tomioka Optical stopped making lenses for other brands after 68, but I cant believe that Yashica would turn down a revenue source just for exclusivity. Something we will probably never know. But it sure is fun to wonder. If you happen to have any recent photos from your Yashica glass I would love to see them.
Jeff- I agree wholeheartedly with your response, and have encountered the same thing many times on this site. Anyone remember "The Negative Space of CMC"? Lol, look that one up in the archive. The internet is like life, you meet all types. Kind souls and douches alike.
