Jupiter 9 Focus and Repair

If the lens focusses corectly at greater distances but is off at close range I'd suspect that the cam is cut to the wrong angle for that particular lens. Get it checked out. I'm not sure, though, that getting a custom machined cam together with labor charges for disassembling and reassembling the lens would be much of a savings over just buying a used Leitz/Leica lens.

The problem can't be corrected with a simple spacer block. The lens doesn't move in and out at the same rate as the rangefinder arm unless the lens' focal length matches that of the rangefinder EXACTLY.

I should clarify. I'm using the lens with a voigtlander ltm adapter on an m4. It's my understanding that russian screwmount bodies (fed, zorki, etc.) need to have their cam adjusted for close-focusing problems, but I'd assumed that wasn't the case for an M body.

Incidentally, the lens does not focus properly at infinity either; the rangefinder images do not coincide fully.

In that case maybe it could be remedied with a different thickness spacer. You'll still be paying American labor rates for an inexpensive lens.

Jeff, I just got the same lens a few days ago but have yet to test it out. I have put it on both my IIIf and M4 and the rangefinder appears to be dead on at infinity. I had another russian lens that actually was dead on with my ltm but off on the M4. I never bothered to get it fixed. Only paid $20.00 for it and didn't like it's fell anyway.

Have you developed any film yet? If so, are the results satisfactory? I noticed that the DOF scale shows a nice gap at f2. The jupiter 9 feels very solid to me. Depending on how much you spent and how much you like the lens, I would consider getting it repaired. Although I have not tried them, KIEV/USA looks like they repair russian lenses. They have a staff of expert russian camera techs and may be able to help. I hope to test this lens out in the next few days and will post some images in the next few week.

A spacer or shim won't do it--that will just throw the lens off at the other end, infinity. Nor can the cam be re-machined, because unlike similar Leica cams the cam on the back of the lens doesn't spin as the lens is focused, so you'll have the same problem as if you shimmed. Also, there is no internal cam adjustment for this. You're stuck.

The only possible scenario I came up with is that there are actually two shimmable spots in the optics--one between the optical group and the focus mount, the other between the front and back element sets. Theoretically, changing the internal shim would change the focal length of the lens so that it would match the camming of the mount. The shim between the optics and mount would then be changed to suit the new focal length. I messed around with this a bit, and decided it's not do-it-at-home stuff.

The rangefinder cam on the Jupiter 9 I had synced up great with the Leica rangefinder-dead on at infinity. Unfortunately, it wasn't anywhere near where the actual optics were focusing. Its not going to be worth trying to get it fixed in my opinion--you'll have way more money sunk into than it is worth, and there is no certainty it will ever be totally accurate even after a technician fools with it. The point is, if it isn't spot on with the focus, what good is the f2.0 aperture? If you want an older, fast tele for the LTM, I think you're better off spending a few bucks more and getting a Nikon or Canon.

You should look at this site. It explains more or less everything. It looks as if most Jupiter-9s can be fixed, but it's time-consuming. I'm currently in the process of fixing mine, and I can't say I recommend it. I love the optics of this lens, but I was tired of having to guess at the focus. . . well, now I've got a good five hours of work ahead of me at least, so if there's any guessing to do, it'll be about which of three slightly different screws secures the guide on the lens cam. Best of luck.

You might find this site by Dante Stellaof interest:

http://www.dantestella.com/technical/compat.html

Dante argues that there is a fundamental design incompatibility between Russian LSM lenses and Leica rangefinder linkage that only becomes noticeable with shallow depth of focus lens/f-stop combinations at close distances. If you accept the information that Stella provides, there may be nothing for you to physically "fix" because there is nothing out of order.

There are a couple of obvious "work arounds" though that come to mind:

1. Compensate for the slight differences in focal point by focusing slighly behind the feature of principal interest in your image (see Stella discussion, this is apparently 3" more distant at a 1.5 meter camera to subject distance.

2. Buy an inexpensive Russian LSM camera body to use with the Jupiter 9. A Fed 2, with its long rangefinder base might be a good choice and can be had for $25.

3. Use a faster film or push the film you're using now to permit stopping the lens down a bit.

Having said all this, I note that I use a silver Jupiter 9 frequently at f2 and f2.8 at a distance of six feet (head and shoulders informal portraiture) with no focus problems I can see and photographed test targets at one meter and with sharp focus at f2.8. I've read that focus problems are more common with the black Jupiter 9's.

I believe the link is using Jay's comments. ?


I have three Jupiter-9's in LTM. The oldest chrome 1959 model focuses correctly at all distances. The two black 1970's model both focus wrong. These effects are with a M3 and adpaters; and with my Bessa R and abunch of Zorki's ; a Lenningrad; and sevral FED's.

The chrome and black lenses have slightly different internal mechanics.

The entire lens block is one assembly; which sits on a shim; this sets the infinity focus of the lens; to the film plane. A Bessa R or Zorki can be placed on bulb; with the film plane taped; and the lens block adjusted for focus; while rotating its fine sub millimeter pitch thread. One of my black lenses had its lens block to high by 0.6mm; which is a horrid error. My trial and error; a shim can my made to get the infinity focus spot on.

The lenses cam surface defines the rangefinder alignment. Both of mine were off on the black models. The lens is dissembled; and one of the helixes must be restarted at a different entry point. There are 4 choices over 360 degrees; one was close; the others way off. One with slightly long was choosen; and then the cam surface lapped to make the rangefinder coincide at infinity. Now the lens focuses correctly at infinity; and the rangefinder is correct at infinity.

The Jupiter-9 LTM's lens cam surface doesnt rotate when focusing. This means the lens cam cannot be hand adjusted for the close up distances. The cam movement is defined by the helicoid; which has a constant pitch. Whether your J-9 focuses correctly at close distances is pure luck. The focal lengths of the Russian lenses are not matched to unique helixes; like the Leica and other lenses. Each lens block has a slightly different focal length. One maybe 85; another 85.8; another 85.3 etc. The movement ot the lens block to focus at one meter is different for each lens above. The pitch of the lens blocks helix needs to be different; and matched for the focal length of the lens

The Leica cameras cam has a specfic movement for focusing at infinity and 3 meters, and 1 meters. The lens cam of any lens must move the same amount; for each focused distance. This has nothing to do with the focal length of the lens.

My success is 1 out of 3 Jupiter-9's focuses ok wide open; and tracks with the rangefinder; it is a chrome 1959 lens. The other Jupiter-9's have been taken apart are reassembled. The inside has several multiple helixes; there are alot of combinations to get goofed up. With my black J-9's; there is no adjustments to correct a missmatch of lens focus helix and focal length. Basically one has a fast paperweight.

A Leica; Zorki,FED, or Lenningrad CAN be adjusted to track the black J-9's above. These cameras allow the gain of the camera's rangefiinder to be adjusted to match a lens. The cameras cam effective arm length is adjusted to get the tracking to match. Here one is making a camera aligned to match a bastard lens. Afterwards; the camera wont track with other lenses. This is an option if one has a bunch of cheap Russian bodies; and wants to use a J-9 on it.

The Russian bodies are fully adjustable; and maybe adjusted to track a Leica lens. The lens mount is shimable; the infinity rangefinder adjustable; and the cameras focus cam adjustable (rotate the pie shaped deal on its arm) for tracking correctly. My Zorki 3C was blueprinted using the 3 adjustments above; and focuses correctly at all distances with Leica LTM glass.

Pray, that your J-9 isn't a frankenstein lens assembled from several cosmetically good parts.:-)

Most often the J-9's helicals are improperly reassembled that one (there are three) goes out of sync with the other two. One helical is responsible for moving the optic block and positioning it at the right position relative to the film for focus. The other at the end positions the cam for camera rangefinder coupling. The middle helical links both. Assembling the three is like arranging a rubic's cube- there are so many ways to put it together, but only one will be correct.

I don't quite agree with Dante Stellas theories. The soviets knew better than just replacing the mounts of Sonnar derived Jupiters to make LTM versions. They knew something about the proper Leica-style camming. Afterall, they were making Leica clones first (ie the FED) before they made the Contax copies (ie Kiev).

Jay