AA Battery Leak/Explode Inside F5 Body

Were these alkaline or lithiums? I have heard that the lithiums can get very hot if short-circuited, however there is supposed to be some built-in protection. I guess you were lucky, though. I have been using the Ni-Mh on my F5 and have had no troubles with them, keeping the lithiums for back-up. Regards,

Alkaline. I am not mentioning the manufacturer as I want to take steps towards getting the problem resolved without making a public fuss. It is one of the big battery companies-- one whose products you see in virtually every large camera, drug & grocery store in the USA. <P>Since making my original post I have been to their website and they claim that they will replace or repair any item (at their discretion) damaged by their product.

Very unusual as far as I know. I have a friend who repairs cameras that recommends against this brand based on the number he has seen that leak. This is not scientific as his customers may buy more of that brand than others. His recommendation is Varta or Energizer.

Based on recommendations from Steve Sint and others on another forum I’m using Energizer L91 lithiums mostly. I also use Energizer MH15 NiMH batteries in my cameras.

Years ago I saw a display by a Varta rep showing the insides of their batteries. There was a device that would puncture the battery’s inner cell and cause it to leak before it would explode from over pressure. The cause of pressure would be heat I’d guess from internal resistance and a heavy load (also reveres charge).

I have had batteries with a built in battery check that activate and ran the cell dead. This was in a digital voice recorder. I won’t buy batteries with one of these devices if I can help it.

---

If one cell goes dead before the others that cell will be reverse charged. This can happen to rechargeable as well as non-rechargeable batteries. It’s possible one of the cells was defective from the start. This could case rapid failure and leakage of the defective cell. This is my best guess.

I doubt that the F5 is at fault. I would think it would take a dead short to cause a fresh set of name brand alkaline cells to leak this rapidly. Someone might ask if you put a cell in backwards but the MS-30 battery holder is failsafe in this respect. I hope you got the camera cleaned out. Is it running? I’m sorry this happened and hope everything turns out ok.

---

The same repairman friend recommended that I pickup spare battery holders for my MD-12(s) as he has seen some crack due to age. I decided to pickup spare holders for my F5 and F100. It’s nice to have preloaded batteries that can replace a used set quickly. The price is about $34.00 and $17.00 respectively at B&H.

Regards,

I never look inside the F5 battery compartment before. There are a number of seams. I can see some sealed seams and other seams I can’t tell. If you haven’t put batteries back into it I don’t think I would. Also I’m told that corrosive material from batteries can wick its way up wires and into a camera damaging the flex after a time. I don’t like writing this. Again sorry this happened.

One thing you should do is to get a Q-tip dabbed with a small amount of vinegar and repeatedly clean the battery compartment changing your Q-tip frequently. The mildly acidic solution neutralizes the alkali battery fluids very efficiently. Just don't go crazy with it and flood your camera...small amounts do the trick.

If the camera is still working and you are reasonably certain that it isn't damaged, this might stop problems down the road. If you think its fried, then of course I'd leave it alone and go after the battery manufacturer.

My only experience of a severe battery leak was a new, Duracell AAA cell in my home theatre universal remote. The remote stopped working and I found a leaky battery in my investigation which I treated using the vinegar treatment prescribed above.

Sounds like a good reason to dust off an F2!Im curious why you dont mention the brand?Do you think that if a few hundred photonetters boycott this brand,that their stock will drop?LOL I use an 8008s for wedding candids,it also has nearly a fistfull of AA's.I often thought about battery's leaking,this would really suck!"Everyready" battery company used to advertise they'd send you a new flashlight if their batts leaked.Im sure they'd draw the line with a multi thousand $$ SLR!

Ellis,

This hasn't happened with my F5 or F100....but it did happen in the drive of my F3 a long time ago. I believe the F3 drive had a seperate on/off switch and I left it on. When the camera failed to turn on, I opened the battery drawer and there was goop everywhere!

I cleaned it off the best I could (didn't know about the vinegar trick then....thanks!) replaced the batteries and the camera functioned perfectly. The battery tray had some corrosion but continued to work until I traded the camera. Guess I was lucky!

The batteries were one of the two top consumer brands. I have used everything....including bulk Sam's Club batteries (no Lithiums) in my F5 with no problems and I've left it on for several days without remembering to turn it off.

However, I think I WILL get a spare battery tray....just in case!

Is this a camera body problem or a battery problem? I have been using "Copper Top" regular and Ultra on many of my Nikon bodies since 1989. I don't shoot as much as pros such as Ellis, but I have never had this problem.

Only a defective battery would have leaked with the way you were using it. I wish you luck trying to get them to assume responsibility and cover repairs.

David,<P>Bravo for the fine post! Your answers are very helpful but until I hear back from the manufacturer, you can draw your own conclusions about the brand used . Thanks to everyone else who has contributed as well. The other thing that hurt is that i have been sent a few rolls of the new Velvia 100F and Astia 100F to test for a magazine review of these films and one of those rolls was in the camera.

Shun,<P>I've been shooting professionally since 1984 and have never personally had this problem either. This just goes to show that you should: a.) Always have backup gear at hand when you need to get work done. & b.) That there is always a first time!<P> Bruce,<P> The warranty and guarantee is posted on their website in the FAQ. ifthey get sticky about it, we go public and also start the legal process with a demand letter.<P>Once thanks to everyone for their good wishes and helpful advice.

First of all, once you mention "Ultra" batteries, at least those of us in the US know which brand it is. They are sold at nearly all supermarkets, Home Depot, Costco ... stores. I see no reason to hide the brand name.

Secondly, if this is a battery problem, I sure hope that nobody credits it to be "yet another F5 defect."

As I said, I have been using "Copper Top" batteries for years and rarely have problems. All sorts of batteries have leaks. I used to use Engergizer and had occasional leaks; that was why I switched to Copper Top, which seems to be better but certainly not perfect. I suppose this is something rare and see no reason to avoid this brand of batteries, unless we hear a lot more cases.

Let's see how the manufacturer deals with it. But Ellis is absolutely right that it is important to have backups. When I travel internationally, I bring 3 Nikon bodies.

Up until a year ago, I thought the days of leaky batteries were long gone. Then I caught a set of Energizers, not more than a couple of months old, slowy corroding in my SB-28. Since then I have seen it once more, again with Energizers. I hope you can get this straightened out painlessly, Ellis.

Ellis; sorry for the problem; batteries can make a mess on rare occasions

OT nicads; when AA nicads came out in the late 1960's; many small electronic flashes would melt down; if he nicads were used. The EF were designed for regular batteries; with a higher internal resistance. A AA nicad can produce 50 amps ; in short circuit conditions; with a special test setup I tested batteries with.....Most AA nicads now have a internal fuse/junction that breaks when the cells is short circuited......

With a small wimpy Vivitar Electronic flash; model 202? ; I used in the mid 1970's; the flash burned up twice; each time factory repaired; then it was stolen with a camera body..............The dinky flash would work well for dozens of shots; then the unit would overheat; and complelely melt down the cases plastic; and stinky like mad; ie burning plastic. When the unit would start to go; one could NOT turn the dam thing off; or even remove the batteries...It would go into meltdown mode; and was taken outside to let it solidify again...........After the second meltdown & repair; I got it back with a note NOT to use nicads with the flash again............later designs were more robust; and nicads were not a problem................................The entire problem was weird; because I had a Prinz tri-lite strobe from 1971 that came with GE nicads; and NEVER had any meltdowns......The newer smaller Vivitar had a thyrister; which had shorter flash duration; at close distances.......

The AA GE nicads were made in the USA; and lasted 3 decades; all the other AA nicads I have bought since then have only lasted 3 to 7 years.......

<b>OT mixed cells & maglites = dangerous</b><BR><BR>Mixing regular carbon zinc; and akaline batteries; and heavy duty types is a dangerous mix; when a <b>sealed</b> flashlight; or device is used. When the batteries get real real old; and leak; the two + different types of chemistries will create a gas buildup in the O-ringed sealed "maglight type" flashlites; and the case can explode with alot of shrapnel. A US Forest Service friend of mine showed me an internal document several years ago; which documented several explosions; and the "check your flashlites" in the field warning notice.......

Ellis,

The "super" cells you were using in your F5 may have received their extra capacity by way of some amazing new electrochemical phenomenon faxed in straight from NASA. But more likely they just have thinner walls so they can contain more goop, and if this is the situation, I recommend you avoid using them in professional situations and avoid using them in professional equipment.

Charlie

I can't offer any help with the batteries...I'd just chaulk it up to a rare incident and forget about it, since you don't say that anything was damaged...but I, too, have samples of Velvia 100 and the new Astia.

All I can say is that the new Astia is wonderful, with skin tones much improved, and great color & contrast without blocking up in the shadows.

I haven't shot the Velvia yet.

What are your impressions of the new films? I may switch from Provia to the new Astia as my standard film because it handles contrasty situations a bit better.

I just talked to my friend about battery brands. He says these days they’re all "equally bad" which is a great comfort. I’ve tried to verify this opinion but I’m disappointed with the information I obtained so far. He also explained why he used to advise against the "leading brand" but I want to verify the information if I can. If it’s obsolete then there is little point. It apparently did not use the kind of seal shown in the Energizer Alkaline "D" cell and what I recall in the Varta (as primitive as these are). Consider the price of these batteries I guess this is all you can expect.

ENERGIZER has battery application manuals. It appears to me and they advertise that their L91 batteries have "Superior leakage resistance compared to other primary battery types." There is a ball, bushing and spring in the vent assembly. The "D" size Energizer Alkaline has a nylon seal and metal spur, a one use system. Once the seal is punctured the battery leaks. This is similar to what I remember about the Varta reps AA battery display. The illustration for Energizer NiMH battery was very low resolution but they have a "resealable vent mechanism" of some type.

http://data.energizer.com/

DURACELL I haven’t found similar information but will try again. I may try ripping a Duracell apart but I don’t feel like doing it today as I’ll need hand and eye protection and disposable clothing.

MAXELL I found a link to consumer batteries but it didn’t work (at least with my browser) so I don’t know what they have to offer.

VARTA has a bunch of Flash presentations. I want tech info not a poor simulation of a TV ad. Oh well.

RAYOVAC has lot of flash and junk but found this...

http://www.rayovac.com/busoem/oem/specs/download.shtml

In the Rayovac cut away I saw no vent mechanism. Perhaps they don’t want us to know there is one? Or maybe they rely on thin wall constriction and the side splitting. I hope they didn’t show it because they don’t want us to know. I’d rather not have a battery split inside my camera. I didn’t read the text yet so there may be more information.

Please don’t think his rambling means that I have great knowledge or expertise concerning batteries. I’m trying to verify or disprove my favored batteries for cameras which are Energizer L91 and NH15. For now these are my security blankets and I’ll drag them everywhere. I’ve felt queasy about putting Alkaline batteries in my cameras for sometime. My primary concern has been dead batteries leaking not new ones.

Anyone have better links? Any industrial spies? Any inside information?

Anyway I tried.

I found the words "SAFETY VENT" on the Rayovac diagram. Now I can go to sleep (but I still don’t know how it works).

the SAFETY VENT is used many times when one tries to charge a "non-chargeable" battery; the cell needs to leak; so there is no explosion

Apparemtly there are several ways that extra current capacity could be acheived in a alkaline cell at the expense of safety; in addition to the use of thinner walls as I mentioned above. So the question is whether your problem is a rare exception due to some factory quality control problem, or else whether "super" high capacity cells are more likely to rupture owing to a compromise in their design. Maybe you will get some pertinent hints from the manufacturer which you can pass along to us. But probably the manufacturer has already begun "spin control".

At Panasonic I found this...

http://www.panasonic.com/consumer_electronics/batteries/how_batts_work.asp

It doesn’t mention a safety seal but it’s got to have one.

Under Panasonic industrial batteries...

"The use of a special resin-sealing inlet and special sealant results in unsurpassed leak-resistance."

http://www.panasonic.com/industrial/battery/oem/images/pdf/Panasonic_Alkaline_Hdbk_02-03_v1.pdf

I'm sure these companies are using different technology than what I saw sometime ago. I was hoping to find similar PDF files for more brands and for consumer battery models. At any rate internal pressure has to be released at some level no matter the cause. Again sorry about the obsolete information regarding brand and leakage.

Guarantee and company integrity followed by performance and price seem to be the considerations.

Ellis I hope you’ll tell us how things go.

Ellis, I shoot weddings and portraits on the weekends, and I keep an older Minolta X-700 setup in my bag. I had some ultra brand - type batteries in my 360PX flash unit, left them in there for a couple of weeks, couldn't understand why the flash was dead. Opened it up, and one of the batteries had poured goop into the battery compartment, corroding the contacts on the compartment door. These batteries were literally brand new. I can find out the name of the manufacturer, I know where I bought them. They were AA alkalines.

I've learned my lesson. I empty all battereis out of my equipment after each shoot. Regardless if the piece costs $150 or $1500, it's still a pain to replace. Good luck.

I'vs had a lot of Toshiba AAs leak. I don't put them in my photo equipment but in a box of 20, 5 will leak. Conni

Hi: Had this problem yesterday. Two F5's with 8 Duracell Ultras in each. Cameras stopped working. My assistant said the battery compartment seemed slimey. Found that both compartments were covered with caustic fluid, and cameras were dead in the water. Removed all batteries, and finished the job with my Hasselblad.

Any recommendations as to best batteries for intense professional use? I read that some of the high powered alkilines have thin walls which are condusive to leaking. Which are best for long use, no leaks, and are best to leave in the camera. Funny thing, this never happened with the Costco Kirkland brand.

Apparently, once again Ultra is the problem. I'll avoid that in the future.